Misterious wreck in Punta della Maestra - KM ship ?

[Antonio Bonomi]

Hello everybody,

I am here searching an help for a friend that likes to identify a wreck in Italy.

The wreck is located in Punta della Maestra near Chioggia ( Venice ) at the end of the Po river.

It seems to be either the Mine Sweeper, ... Mine Sucher, ... Regio Dragamine, RD17 ( former M 1227 of the Kriegsmarine after ) or the RD 26   ( former M 1229 of the Kriegsmarine after ).

It can be also one of the FL. B 404-444 ships, ... maybe the number 422.

It seems the the ship was attacked and sunk by an airplane in the spring of 1945, ... the damage is on the left
of her bow, .. it carries a 76 mm gun.

Neither publications by Franco Bargoni ( Ufficio Storico della Marina ) or Erich Groner books are providing the help needed to identify this ship successfully.

If anybody here in is in condition to provide any sort of help to identify or remove potential ships from the above 3 candidates, ... that can be very helpful indeed.

Thanking in advance for you attention, ... Gruss Antonio 

[Teddy Suhren]

Hai

Have you checked the Database for the FL.B Boats in the HMA? 
https://www.historisches-marinearchiv.de/projekte/luftwaffen_schiffe/beschreibung.php

[Darius]

Hi Antonio,

for RD 17 & RD 26 we have for both as lost in greek waters at the moment:
https://www.historisches-marinearchiv.de/projekte/minensucher/ausgabe.php?where_value=725
https://www.historisches-marinearchiv.de/projekte/minensucher/ausgabe.php?where_value=726


Regards & 

Darius

[Darius]

Next idea: Have you checked "Adriatic Naval War 1940 - 1945"?
https://www.amazon.de/Adriatic-Naval-War-1940-1945/dp/9537892441




Darius

[crolick]

Antonio,

FLB-boote were between 23-24 m long and no 76 mm gun.

RD17 and RD26 were around 33-36 m long and were equipped with 76 mm gun each.

Hence I would tend to search in the direction of RD-boats


Hope that helps!
Andrzej

[Antonio Bonomi]

Hello everybody,

first of all I like to thank T-Geronimo, Teddy  Suhren, Darius and Crolick for the help they are trying to provide me.

This said I would like to share the link where some Italian expert scuba divers are exchanging some photos of this ship wreck and their information taken from Franco Bargoni, Erich Groner and also the Zvonimir Freivogel book you mentioned to me, ... so those infos have been carefully scrutinized already.

https://www.aidmen.it/forums/topic/652-relitto-di-un-rd-al-largo-di-punta-della-maestra/

I think I would agree with Crolick about the RD being the most possible solution,  as the ship wreck is 37 meters long ( M 1228 ) and has the 76/40 mm gun as stated.

This is the reason why I am trying to obtain as more information as I can about the real destiny of the M 1227; M 1228 and  M 1229 as the information provided by Erich Groner are not so precise as you can read. 

For example the sinking of the M 1228 in La Spezia is not confirmed by any source at all, ... and its length just fit the ship wreck, ... being 4 meters longer then the M 1227 and M 1229.

Maybe the Adria Flotilla Kriegstagebuch can help, as those shisp were all depending from the Kommando  site in Adria during the end of 1944 and the first months of 1945.

The Adria Kommando Kriegstagebuch may contain precious information about the loss of those type of ships and the sinking date and location, ... at the Po river end into the Adriatic sea, ... just a bit south of Chioggia, ... near Punta della Maestra.

Problem is I do not have all the Adria Kommando KTB's and I cannot read like you their German texture.

Thanks for any help anyway, ... Antonio 

[Iceman]

Good morning to all,
I tend to exclude all the RDs captured in Greece because was difficult to transfer throught Otranto Channel, ships that were steaming no more than 10 kt. Also the gun of the RD was usually a 76/50 and not a 76/40, with different mounting.
I'd like to give you a new option: the trawler ORATA, later IV 60 and later G 322. The dimensions are similar, the gun was sure a 76/40 and many sources differ about her fate. As far as I know, no wreck was found in Arsa canal (as stated in some sources), but maybe someone has more info about this last. Also the KTB don't help about the fate of this vessel.

Best regards

Marco Ghiglino

[TW]

Zu RD 26 (M 1228) heißt es: 1944 Verlust in/bei La Spezia.
Die M-Kennung (12. Räumbootsflottille, B-Gruppe Ägäis) ist eigentlich nur im Dezember 1943 nachweisbar.
RD 26 war vielmehr GA 81 bei der Küstenschutzflottille Attika.

Ein Transfer im Jahr 1944 aus der Ägäis ins Westliche Mittelmeer scheint mir fast unmöglich. Für denkbar halte ich allerdings, dass GA-Boote 1944 auch westlich von Griechenland operierten und danach im Ionischen oder Adriatischen Meer verloren gingen.

Kann Jemand einen Blick ins KTB der Küstenschutzflottille Attika werfen und einmal nachsehen,
ob irgendwelche GA-Boote 1944 nachweisbar auch westlich von Griechenland operierten ?
Gruß, Thomas